kush kingdom

Who can stop mossad if its surrounded by perhaps what you will describe as holy war? 4000 year old quarells, i guess even Jesus might have been frustrated but hey now we know where WW111 starts!

BUDDY1

The isralites brought this upon themslves.they have been killing innocent and unarmed people of Palestine for more than 60 years and the world is not saying anything about it.It is the greed of the jews and USA that is forever making to choose to live freely or rather die if they are not free.Yes I agree that a solution cannot be reached by force but the Palestine people have no other altenative at their disposal.The USA ,Britain and Israel consumed the resources of Africa and they are trying to do the same to the middle east.I am a 100% supporter of the fight against oppression to our brothers in PALESTINE.

Carly Weinberg

Not all Jews are Israeli’s, Buddy1, please get your facts right.
No nation on earth would allow hundreds of rockets to be fired into their country without some form of retaliation.

abe

this is like apartheid South Africa when the apartheid regime were killing innocent civillians with impunity saying they are terrorists

Steven

As in any civilised coutry you have the right of self defense. If you hit me I will hit you back, but to hide behind the skirts of mothers, children, mosque goers ets is cowardice and then to complain when they are injured. Hamas does not care for its people it only seeks publicity.

Africa Calling

Israel has no choice but to carry out these attacks. This is not though the solution to the problem. Israel are damed if they dont do anything, and damned if they do. The real solution is solving the Palestinian question.

The Palestinian question will only be solved when Israel and Palestinians discuss over a table without interference from the USA and other Arab States. The USA has a need for Israel to exist. The Arabs have a need for Israel not to exist. From a strategic point of view, Israel is important to the USA.

We must not forget our own border war against Russian made arms in the 1980’s. This war was in part because of USA and Russian interests in our region. With the collapse of the Soviet Union, the regional interests went away, and so did the conflict. None of us wanted to go to the border. We knew what we were doing, but there was no alternative solution at the time, because the politicians in Moscow and Washington decided to use Angola and Mozambique as a battle ground.

The same therefore applies to Israel. One the rest of the world stops interfering with Israel, then there can be a solution.

I dont believe its fair to say the Jews were there first or the Arabs were there first. They must both realize that we live in a Global world, and in the Global context of the world, its time to put differences aside, allow the Palestinians the right of return and negociate a proper well meaning settlement.

The other funny thing is that although the arabs are upset about the Gaza problem, the oil price has gone up. So in fact the Arabs can thank the Jews for a higher oil price….now isnt that a funny thing to consider.

Ultimately you cannot negociate with a drug dealer, fanatic, alcoholic, fundamentalist. There is no point, the only solution is a band aid, by bombing and forcing your opponent into submission so that you can fight again another day.

Israel has disgustingly forced people off the land and in there own way, practice there own fundamentalist form of jewish extremisim.

The jews and the arabs have enough money to solve this problem once and for all, however the solution will only be found once the USA makes peace with Iran and Syria. Until then, there will be no solution.

Allan

I notice the slideshow seems one-sided. Are photographers only covering the situation in Gaza – where were they when rockets were falling on Israel? Is the Times showing both sides, or just relying on AP who tend to only tell the Hamas story. I imagine it was the photographer who wrote the cutlines and he clearly is getting friendly access from Hamas. Great imagery but let’s have balanced reporting.

Jude

Allan, in defence of the Times, as a photographer myself, for reporting of this kind you take what you can get – it’s the politics of access.

In conflict, or emotionally heightened situations, the pictures you get depend on the a) The nature of the conflict and warring parties and b) how much weight the name of the agency in area carries and c) how creative the photographer is

In the Israeli/Palestinian case, the nature of the conflict determines your pictures. The Israelis have superior firepower, organization and a standing army, whereas the Palestinians do not. The Israelis would not allow you to take pictures that might show them as weak, but are hard pressed to prevent images that show them as the aggressors. The Palestinians have the converse on their side.

Creativity – Pictures lend themselves to the most graphic of content – otherwise it might as well be writing or music. If there is a plume of smoke from a bomb, you take that picture, and it symbolises the most immediate, attention grabbing aspect of the situation – in this case, its shows the scale of the conflict. And so on and so forth with all pics coming from the conflict. This however is not to denigrate powerful pictures that can be achieved with simple symbolism.

I have no idea how the agencies negotiate access to the Israel and the Gaza strip, but take Zimbabwe in mind – the BBC, pawn of the English aggressor according to Bob – if they were ever allowed into Zimbabwe, they would only be allowed footage of Mugabe having tea with old ladies. In short, as Chomsky would say: objectivity is a myth.

Moosa

I have been following different online forums on the events in Gaza. What stands out very clearly is the disproportionate response by zionist supporters (note: I am not saying jews) and apologists for Israel’s horrendous crimes against innocent civilians in Gaza, to silence or make ineffective any valid and reasonable criticism of the actions of Israel. It is clear that in our dear country South Africa, the Zionist lobby is alive and well and is in fact flourishing.

A relative went to Jerusalem to visit Aqsa and was addressed by an Israeli soldier in Afrikaans. SA governement is turning a blind eye to jews going to Israel to serve in the IDF. Yet there will be a big outcry if Muslims volunteer to go out and fight on the side of the Palestinians

Mike

Moosa, if South African Jews choose to serve in the IDF then that is their choice and their right. Likewise if South African Muslims decide to fight for the Palestinians. There is absolutely no conceivable reason why the SA Government would disallow such a thing. We live in a democratic country and each individual has the right to fight for a cause.

Hamas are cowards. Firing hundreds of rockets into Israel with the intent to do harm. Then they hide amongst their own people and hide their weapons in Mosques, knowing full well that by doing so their own people will get caught up in battle. They care as much for their fellow Palestinians as they do about Israeli’s.

Moosa

Mike the South African government has stopped any citizen from participating in foreign wars, but this is a double standard. Whereas muslims are not allowed to leave, jews are still fighting in Israel.

It is amazing how consistent Israeli supporters will bring over the same perspectives wherever they are, yet they refuse to acknowledge the essentially inhumane manner and disproportionate response of the IDF using modern weapons in an urban setting which results in civilian deaths. Why dont they stop being cowardly (to use your accusation) and go after the Hamas fighters in the city.

Like your American friends they want to make war like it is a tv game with no consequences for themselves. Muslims fighting the just fight however are keen on laying down their lives for God and their homes. Israel is the aggressor and their history has proven this over and over again, no matter how they try to control the media and what people think.

Remember Deir Yassin, Qana, Sabra and Shatila,USS Liberty, massacres of thousands of Egyptian POW’s in the 1967 war. These facts cannot be covered up forever.

Imtiaz

Alan – we should be grateful for teh few images that we are receiving from inside Gaza – particularly as the Israeli’s have instituted a media black-out (http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/11/12/news/ML-Israel-Gaza-Blackout.php) in a bid to prevent the world from seeing the real horror of their aggression. Furthermore, it cannot be denied that there is disproportionate damage and death (100 times teh number of deaths) on the Gaza side and therefore also a disproportionate amount of images depicting Palestinian victims.

Our press is generally more balanced than that of other countries and notably the US. This article should provide you with a different perspective of media reporting: http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/war_on_gaza/2009/01/20091585448204690.html

Steven – indeed, every country has the right, by International Law, to defend its citizens but that right is limited to identifying and punishing the perpetrators responsible for the attacks and not indiscriminate and disproportionate actions which kill innocent women and children in their hundreds – or else how different is the state of Israel from the so-called terrorists? Right now the only distinction between the two is that the Israeli’s have killed a 100 times more people than Hamas.

Furthermore, the attacks were certainly not one-sided – the Israeli’s are not, and have never been passive or innocent bystanders in this whole affair. As said, UN Relief Coordinator Jan Egeland: “Gaza is a ticking timebomb. You can not seal off an area which is a little bit bigger than the city of Stockholm and have 1.4 million people, of whom 800,000 are youth and children and then have 200 artillery shells a day going in there, virtually.” This is like shooting fish in a bucket !

Already in 2006, Jan Egeland, and Jan Eliasson, then Swedish foreign minister had written in Le Figaro: “Some 1.4 million people, mostly children, are piled up in one of the most densely populated regions of the world, with no freedom of movement, no place to run, and no space to hide.” They described people “living in a cage,” cut off by land, sea, and air, with no reliable power and little water, tortured by hunger, disease, and incessant attacks by Israeli troops and planes. Gaza is nothing but an Israeli concentration camp. I am sure that if dogs were treated in this way, even some of the commentators defending Israeli action would be outraged …

Before this attack on Gaza, perhaps only one Israeli was killed by rocket fire – this war has very little to do with this rocket fire – it is merely an excuse for the Israeli’s to expel the effect regime change by liquidating the democratically elected Hamas and pave the way for a more amenable, corrupt and pliant Mahmoud Abbas. A Israeli coup d’ tat…

In the meanwhile, while Gaza is on the brink of genocide with bodies piled up on the streets and hospital floors, Barak and Livni can revel in the fact that their popularity has risen dramatically ahead of the upcoming elections….

Moosa

Why did the times remove my response to Mike’s comment above which I posted earlier?

This makes me wonder about the freedom of the press in South Africa and where their loyalties lie.

patrice

Well, innocent people always die! As a christian i think the war between Israel and Palestine will only end once palestine submit to israel because that land was given to them by the almighty God! People die everywhere…In Congo the democratic republic of, people loose thier lives every single day! Are palestinian people better than africans??? Palestinians and israelites knows the end to that war, the world should know that.
ARMAGEDON!!!!!